Creative Communities with Maddox and Dwight

Britt East [00:00:02] Welcome to Not Going Quietly the podcast where we inspire growth, beat down biases and get into all sorts of good trouble with your host Britt East. No topic is off limits as we explore ways to help everyone leap into life with a greater sense of clarity, passion, purpose and joy. So get ready to join us for some courageous conversation, because not going quietly starts right now.

Britt East [00:00:30] Hey, everyone. Welcome to the Not Going Quietly the podcast for heartbroken healers and outraged optimists all over the world where we surface life searing truths in the name of radical togetherness. I'm your host, Britt East, and I have these two fabulous guys that I can't wait to introduce you to. So let me dive right in. Maddox and Dwight, known as the Connections and Community guys, started by hosting small gatherings to expand their social circle. These gatherings quickly grew in popularity, revealing the positive impact they could have on their local community. Soon they began attracting a vibrant circle of creatives who felt a strong need for a common, quote unquote, watering hole, a place to connect meaningfully and share their unique journeys. Realizing they had something special, Maddox and Dwight turned this passion into purpose. Now they're excited to launch For the Love of Creatives, a private podcast and membership community dedicated to creativity, collaboration and elevation in men. Both Maddox and Dwight are certified coaches with expertise in event facilitation, community leadership and social intelligence. Maddox Dwight, welcome to the podcast. How are you guys doing today?

Dwight [00:01:52] It's great to be here.

Maddox [00:01:53] Thanks, Britt. Yes, it is great to be here. It's been a long time since we last spoke and it's just really nice to see your face.

Britt East [00:02:00] Yeah, you too. For those of you listeners who don't remember, Maddox was on a previous episode of Not Going Quietly, and I'm so thrilled to have him back. And this is our first time with Dwight. It's so fabulous to meet you, Dwight. I'm really excited to learn about your message and what you've got in store for us. So why don't you tell our audience more about, you know, for the for the love of creatives, what is the community about? What can folks expect to get out of it in the podcast?

Dwight [00:02:31] There's so much. I mean, for the love of creatives, as you described in the introduction, was something that was born out of our need to try to build community. We started out by hosting small gatherings in our.

Maddox [00:02:47] Home.

Dwight [00:02:48] And we had a couple of remote events that were heavily attended by people that were in the arts, and those were the most exciting, the most fun, the most vibrant. And after doing a couple of those, it seemed like that really seems to be where the calling is. That really seems to be where we're drawn. And, you know, before we were really just trying to figure out how it was that we could meet people, how how it was that we could get people to come out of the funk that they were in after being in lockdowns where they forgot how to people. Well, and it was it was like we were really missing because a lot of people that were in the state where they were complaining about being lonely and not really knowing how to connect. Yeah, there's a point where that's a choice. But, you know, we we found that people that were creating things.

Maddox [00:03:51] Really understood what it was.

Dwight [00:03:53] To do that. Not in a vacuum, not in a place where no one ever sees their work, but they really need to get out and be with people and be with other creative people so that they could have a way of being able to make their make their creations, have new life and live on through conversations and and be the spark for the next ideas.

Maddox [00:04:20] Yeah. During the pandemic. I said, when this is over and I can go back out into the streets. And move freely without a mask. I'm going to do whatever it takes to create a ethic. Social life. I'm going to turn my home into a social hub. That was literally the goal. And then we met him and he had a similar goal. He liked what what my goal was. So we started hosting gatherings together. We never dreamed that it would turn into. Something more like it has just started off to be want to make some new friends. And here we are. I guess. October last month made two full years that we've been hosting events. We've probably hosted more than 20 now, and it just naturally evolved. It was like one day we just looked around and went, Wow, this whole creative thing, it really blows both of our skirts up and you know, it. It's we just thought, there it is right there. It's like the low hanging fruit right there in front of us. And we had been doing some planning something else where we weren't sure where we were going to find those people. And then when the creative thing presented itself, we were like, Dang, we know exactly where we can find those people. And it just made sense, you know? I'm. Those events were very engaging, the people really engaged in a magical way. And that spoke to both of us.

Britt East [00:05:58] So beautiful. What I know about you. One thing I know I'm sorry. One thing I know about Maddox is when he says he's going to do something, he actually does it. And so it's like, look out. He's actually when he says he's going to do a social hub, he's going to do a social hub. So.

Maddox [00:06:13] You know, it's amazing how many people in my life reflect that back to me. You know, somebody said to me today sent me a text and said, you know, that's one of the things I've always admired about you. You just get some cockamamie idea in your head and you go for it. Yeah, I do. They've not all been successful, but I still went for it and had a blast. You know, even if it failed, I had a good time. So.

Britt East [00:06:37] Yeah. Yeah. And it's like. That doesn't sound like failure to me. That sounds like experimentation and homing in on such an invitation.

Maddox [00:06:45] Yes. You ask how we were doing? I would say we're both kind of stressed right now. We have. Put a lot on our plate with all this. We're trying to launch the podcast. We've got a big venue coming up for February 1st, a live event that will facilitate for about 100 people in a big gallery down in the design district. And on that same date, we're officially launching the membership community. It's all in title for the love of creatives. We have the experience, we have the podcasts and we have the community.

Britt East [00:07:22] No pressure that. That's a lot. That's a.

Maddox [00:07:24] Lot. It's a lot. Yeah. Probably more than I thought when we hit it off.

Britt East [00:07:30] So you mentioned both of you alluded to the fact that it was like a bolt of lightning when you got a bunch of creatives, maybe some professional, maybe some avocation or maybe some amateur in the room together. What was it? Why creatives like why do you think that stood out to you and resonated so deeply with you so quickly?

Maddox [00:07:51] You know, I think that I have always had quite a few creatives in my life. I've had friends that owned art galleries and I go to a lot of art openings and I love live theater and I have friends that act and sing and perform. And so I don't know. I don't remember exactly. We made friends with an artist and his assistant and we were just chewing the fat one day and asked them if they'd like to collaborate on one of our events with us. And they were like, Well, yeah. And so they had lists of pretty big lists of people in the arts. And that was our first quote unquote party. That was for creatives. And it was just like, knock your socks off. Wow.

Dwight [00:08:46] Yeah. It was amazing because one of the things that really drove the success of that event was how that particular artist, when we were having talks with them, we we leaned in on how essential it was to take care of that the basic people, parts of it, to really reach out, to let people know how important it was to execute manners that have kind of fallen to the wayside. One of the things that we had dealt with up to that point was there was a lot of FOMO and a lot of people that were just kind of flaky. They couldn't commit to actually come to the event. And the way that we do these things, there is a lot that's dependent on there being bodies in the room, there being energy and engagement. And if you have people that are just waiting around for something better to come along, then it's it's ruined from the beginning. And so he got his squad and within a day, I think the event was filled.

Maddox [00:09:53] Yeah. We sent invitations out and, and I think it was, it was less than 24 hours. It was sold out with a wait list, you know, and. Yeah. And people were like, my God. They were all day, all day long. I've never experienced anything like this. You know, it's not a party, although in the beginning we did serve food and cocktails and the one we're planning, we're going to have food and mocktails for insurance purposes. We don't do our alcohol anymore. But it is a facilitated event. People don't just stand around with a cocktail in their hand, and it's not a networking event. In fact, we don't say the N-word in our house.

Dwight [00:10:37] Yeah. I think the other thing that's kind of important is that it's really something that's engaging before they actually even show up. Like before they cross the threshold. There's a lot that we're doing to engage them to get them ready. And we're doing a lot to kind of set the stage. And a big part of our evenings has been making it so that people know that they're in the right headspace when they're taking part. And we actually had a really fun experience where because of some inclement weather, some people weren't actually able to make it to the opening circle at one of our events. And we could see the difference between people who had the experience of the briefing where the things we stress are that they needed to be open, they needed to push aside any of that tendency to have judgment and to be willing to approach people with curiosity and vulnerability. And the late comers. We had some of them that were just so not ready to be in that space. One man, I think he was there for five minutes and he said, I just can't do this.

Maddox [00:11:53] I have to go. And he voted out the door. You know, we we call people to get a little bit vulnerable. You know, we we put them in a little groups or we put them in pairs and there's like tasks that they have to do. And the crazy thing about it is, with the exception of this one person, everybody just loves it, you know? I mean, the big the big thing happened when we were maybe. Eight months in, we've done maybe 8 or 10 events. And at one of the events, somebody walked up to us and said. What you are charged to do this. And we look at each other and we said, Can we get back to you? You know, it was like we never dawned on us that people would pay us to do what we were just doing for fun. And that was the way it you know, the day that it kind of switched from just some social fun to. A business? Yeah. A business that we really believe that we can impact a very large group of people in a very positive way.

Britt East [00:13:06] So what then is the community that you're creating in the private podcast? Is it sort of an online recreation of the in-person event, or are you teaching people how to host their own events or sort of. Is it something completely different? What can people expect?

Maddox [00:13:22] You know, we're still in development of a lot of this. The reason to bring people together is and we hear this day in, day out from creatives and such a high percentage of that population are introverts. Yeah. And they tend to be in isolation, solitude. They do their creative things by themselves. They do the business aspects of whatever it is that they're doing, if they're marketing their art or whatever. They do that oftentimes by themselves. They wear all the hats and very unsuccessfully, most of them, hence the term starving artist. And we just saw this huge need, You know that. Both the podcast and the community is bringing those solo creatives from me to we. Yeah, because we believe that when they can step out of the solitude, it doesn't mean they have to make art in big rooms. The people that are also making art, it's not about the creation part, but it can be. I know I, I've painted some in my life and the times I've painted the best art and had the most fun was when I was painting with other people, painting right around me.

Dwight [00:14:39] Well, and you you brought up a very interesting point about introverts. Early on, the feedback that we were getting when we were hosting the events was that a lot of people who identified as introverts told us that they would have never, ever thought of doing anything remotely like the gatherings that we had because they found it to be the most frightening thing. But the way that we made space for everyone made it so that they felt okay. They could fully express themselves and not feel that there was any risk of judgment. And there's definitely a parallel spirit. And and the artists, you know, no matter what field they're there, their creativity is in.

Maddox [00:15:29] Yeah. Common comments would be from some of these introverts. my God, I've never ever been to any social function where it was as easy as this. Yeah. And the whole purpose of what we do, the whole facilitation is to do just exactly that. We've all been to parties where there were little clumps of people and you couldn't really break in. You know, it was click ish, right? And there were always people standing in the corner or along the wall all by themselves with the deer in the headlights look on their face. You know, I've been that person a lot in my life. I'm very outgoing when I know you. But if I'm in a roomful of strangers, I'm kind of shy, and it's hard for me to walk up to a group of strangers and talk. So I was the one standing over next to the wall or in the corner hoping somebody would come up and say hello to me. And I know how uncomfortable and awkward that is and oftentimes disappointing because you stand there all evening and then you leave not having ever even talked to anybody. Yeah. And I just we just didn't want people to experience that. So, you know, we police the room, man. If there's anybody standing by themselves, we go grab them and usher them into one of the little groups that there is a little group, you know, part of the evening is facilitated. Then part of it they have a little bit of free time and it's back and forth, right? So it keeps things really moving. Usually the event is two hours long and it's the fastest two hours you can imagine. It goes by so fast.

Dwight [00:17:01] Yeah. And one of the things that that we noted as we were doing these was when we would go to other events, we were absolutely ruined because a lot of the things that people associate with having a good time are usually because they're distracted, they're drunk or otherwise not in their right mind. So they fill in the blanks and just think, well, I must have had a good time. You know, there there is nothing like going into a place and picking it apart. You know, we're taking notes. We're trying to figure out, okay, what is it that we need to do to really deliver an experience as we're walking through? And so one of them was had a Christmas party that was just dreadful.

Maddox [00:17:49] My God. I would rather had a root canal. It was so bad.

Dwight [00:17:54] It was just weird. And you had your cliques and they had there were some people that had something that really drew them together. We were not their crowd. We were not volleyball coaches, so we had nothing to say to anyone. And another event was an open house for a new bank where a lot of people that were just kind of insiders in that scene were coming in and being seen. And I could see and with the body language in the room that it was one of those situations where if if we weren't part of their crowd or there was no way to bust into the circles.

Maddox [00:18:27] I remember at that bank thing we walked up to a gentleman and what was the question you ask him? Do you remember? I don't remember the question, but it was just showing up with interest. Something like it was something that was different than what do you do that it's not a what do you do? It was something like, well, what do you have passion about? Or and his hives got really big and he said, I have to find my wife. And he voted off. He was like, bless your heart.

Britt East [00:18:57] What are you guys doing to these poor people? Leaving the regret, creating catharsis wherever you go.

Maddox [00:19:04] And, you know, the cool thing about it is what we do really does polarize people. We know really fast whether they're our people are not. And we celebrate with those that scream and run and we celebrate, you know. Yeah, more room for the people who really want to come and sit between us. Yes.

Britt East [00:19:25] And then what do you guys have against networking? I'm sitting over here with my MBA degree and my business card and thinking about how I can transact with people at a party. What's the what's the deal?

Maddox [00:19:35] That's it right there. That's it is the word transaction, right. Traditional network networking is all a transaction. And I'm sorry, that's just.

Dwight [00:19:46] Yeah. You know, one of the things you learn in business is that quid pro quo will get you some issues.

Maddox [00:19:53] And you know what? What we're after is the relational aspect, not the transactional.

Britt East [00:20:01] That's really beautiful. That's really beautiful.

Maddox [00:20:04] But it has like you said, it's totally ruined us for regular parties. Any time we go to an event, we're looking at each other like, my God, can we get out of here? This is so bad.

Britt East [00:20:14] So what what is your, like, big, hairy, audacious goal with this community? What do you what do you what is your big vision and your purpose ultimately?

Dwight [00:20:25] This is our way of being able to contribute, to heal something that is is broken. One of the things that that really drove me into this was, well, I'll share a little bit about my pandemic story. I spent the pandemic lockdowns caring for a husband with a terminal illness. And it was incredibly hard to be isolated. But. I could see that he was going into the rabbit holes that are created by all of the the things that you can scroll on. And in some ways becoming less human. We cherish the time that we had together. And as his health declined, there was more of that together time. But for the most part, we saw all of the things that that you can mark that time by the hate, the the misinformation and just the weirdness. Well, the thing is, that was a an interesting experiment without everyone being locked in their homes. There's still that going on in the background. There's still that dull buzz of people being uneasy falling into their filter bubbles. And the thing is, if we look back and think about what things were like for our great grandparents, you know, there was nothing to scroll on. It didn't matter if they didn't particularly care for their neighbors. That proximity brought them together. And they had an interest in what was going on in the community of people that they could see because they were all affected by the same things. Whereas because of our high technology and the way that we can transport ourselves to some other place and be disconnected from everything going on around us. And in some ways that's really broken. And it's it's really hard to fight against that. But by reminding people what it is to get dopamine from something that's accompanied by a bath of other chemicals that come from actual human touch making eye contact and and actually just being decent around people.

Maddox [00:22:54] Sharing a little bit of yourself with each other.

Dwight [00:22:57] Yes.

Maddox [00:22:59] You ask about the purpose and what came to my mind was we got invited recently to a racial healing circle. And it was a very interesting evening. We really enjoyed it. No where in the evening did we talk about racial issues or racism? But we walked away and I said, you know. Because they put the word racial in the name of the circle. All the people that came were the people that didn't really need to come. And the people that really needed to come wouldn't come because it said racial in the name. And I said, you know, I looked at what they were doing there that night, the conversations and what they were guided, facilitated activities. And I went. We do that? Yeah, we do it a little bit differently, but we do it. And I and I realized, you know, we don't say anything about race. I mean, we do have a diversity statement, which we promptly put up there. But it's about everything. It's race is only a teeny part of it. In our events, and this has been across the board with almost every event we've had. The room is filled with every age group from in their early 20s to 70s. There are male, there are female, there are straight, gay, trans, non-binary. Not a lot of them sometimes, but some representation. There are every color of the skin that you can imagine. Our groups, when they come in, just magically are extremely diverse and we believe. That that is the way we will heal our planet. Of all of the isms, that's when we can put people as different as you can. You know, there was a time when I would plan parties and I would put them in a little boxes. So we're going to hell have the white people over tonight. Next Saturday, I'll do the X color or age groups or straight or gay. I segregate them thinking that it just wouldn't be wise to put them all together. And then one day I just daringly thought, I want to see what happens. And it was magical. And it's been magical with every event we've done. In fact, the one event that we did that we've done together where we it was all the gay boys. My gosh. Worst event that we've done. Worst event. Worst, lowest energy. The room was flat. You know, we couldn't get him to talk to each other. Two different people walked up to me and said, my God, this is making me so uncomfortable. I think I need to leave. But it was there were people that showed up late and left early. There were people that stood over in the corner and wouldn't talk to anyone else. It was the most awkward thing. Now, you know, if it were a typical cocktail party, no problem. Everybody's slamming the drinks down and people are talking and it goes on. But the minute you start to put them in little groups and give them a hard question to answer. It went tits up. You know, and Brett, you know that I hosted a podcast for two years called The Authentic Gay Man, and really at that time was pursuing, wanting to coach gay men, wanting to host a community of gay men. And that podcast, although that was a beautiful experience and I'm so glad I did it. I loved every moment. I met some of the most amazing men that I've been in that I've met in my life. It was still enough to let me know that I did not indeed want to do that. And there was somewhere along the way right around that time that I got this really strong message. You know, that message that just comes into your beingness. It wasn't like the clouds parted and God said. It was just this message that it was time to stop separating ourselves. It was time to address humanity, to serve humanity. We keep compartmentalizing in and putting ourselves in boxes, and that's not working for us. You know, I've been out for 44 years and I've listened to the community, the gay community bitch and complain about just why can't we just be accepted? We just want to be accepted. Now the straight community has come in and filtered into our gay communities, filtered into our gay bars. They're completely cool. They want to hang out with us. And I can't hardly find a gay man that doesn't friggin hate that. They've taken. It was the last thing we had. It was ours. I don't want him in our bars. I don't want him in our community. It was the safe place that we had. G I still feels safe to me. I don't know. You know, it's like. Anyway, a little off topic. Had to go off on a little bit of a rant there. But the message was serve humanity, bring people together in a unique way. And when you get that diversity in one room. My God, it's. Magical is a complete understatement. I can't find a word that really does it justice.

Dwight [00:29:06] There there is something that is just affirming when you see people that maybe for the first time they can be completely themselves. And there's just a transformation that happens. You know, we were talking about people that are used to networking. You know, there's a script that they follow and they they know that there's just certain things that they're going to do because it's part of it's part of the game. But when we move the goalposts, we change the rules. We make it so that the best way that they can operate in this space is to just be fully who they are to to let you know, let everything out. It's liberating. And it's it's something that I think it's so foreign now, especially that people get it and they, you know, they want more of it.

Britt East [00:30:09] You're basically telling me you're sadists is what you are.

Maddox [00:30:15] Say that again. I didn't hear that.

Britt East [00:30:17] You're basically telling me that you're sadists. But but. Okay. No, I love this. This is actually the reason why I wanted to have you on the episode. And I resonate so deeply with what you both just said. And this is based on my personal journey. Everybody's going to have a different journey and arc. But I agree with what Maddox's your take has been your tough truth for the community. For me, as I've aged and I've probably been now, let's say I'm 50, I've probably been out over 30 years, you know, 32 years. I guess there's been diminishing returns on the label. And now I'm moving into more of a life beyond labels. And I don't deny anybody the thrill of finding a community or slapping on a label, but it feels more like a hat or a name tag that doesn't mask who you are, that you can shed it will that serves you. You don't serve it. And I think a lot of us have gotten it backwards where it becomes our identity, where we hide behind it, where we use it for a quick serotonin boost or adrenaline hit. As Dwight was alluding to earlier, the cocktails we kind of keep ourselves anesthetized with. And so I agree so much with you. And this you know, I don't know that there's anybody tougher on straight people than me or more searing about the realities of the modern world. But when I was reflecting on, you know, here we are in November of late November of 2024, after this cataclysmic election that we had in the U.S., when I reflect on it and the potential dire consequences of what we're all about to endure together, it actually made me want to be with people more, to be in more community with people, not less. Instead of cloister ING and erecting walls and putting up gates and trying to create a safe space, quote unquote. And it's made me want to be brave and create brave spaces. In fact, my previous podcast episode was with a young queer person who was advocating this as well. It made me so excited to hear this coming from a young person about like, we don't have to coddle our delicate sensibilities. Lord knows we don't need to coddle straight people, but we can be mutually brave and we can create brave spaces that call us forward, that evoke our adventurous, tender hearts. And so much I think of. Maybe I can't help but wonder about the secret of your success, as maybe Dwight was alluding to, is the prep work, the pre-work, the containers that you create. So safety is intrinsically communicated in signal. That's the baseline. That's not the goal. The goal is to entice people out of themselves into something new, to have a big messy adventure, because that's what's human. That's relating these big, messy mutual adventures that we share with one another. And that's what's got me so excited about your work.

Maddox [00:33:23] You know, what we really learned and got clear on was that the two of us do not have the ability to create safe space. It's not humanly possible. And we we say this out loud and we in the beginning of every event, we put people in a circle and we kind of give them a little overview of what's going to happen that evening. And we tell them that we hold space. The two of us hold space for a safe container, but that we cannot do that without each one of them. And it takes every single person. And we ask point blank, are you willing to create your part of a safe circle tonight? Please raise your hand. And they raise their hands. And, you know, they they've made a commitment in front of everybody right then and there. And it changes the energy in the room. And then when we ask them questions that involve vulnerable answers, they're more inclined to participate because they do feel safe. Not because we created it, but they all co-created it.

Britt East [00:34:36] The beautiful they have skin in the game at that point. They they are part of the process. They're invested. It's not being done to them. It's being done with.

Maddox [00:34:44] Them, you know? Social skills have been on the decline for a long time now. You know, we took a really, really and I'm sure there's things before this, but when I really first became aware, it was we took a hit when handheld devices came out. You know, all of a sudden we got a screen to look at rather than to look into the eyes of the person sitting across the dinner table from us. We took another hit when social media came on board. Now people are scrolled doomscrolling instead of connecting with each other. And if that wasn't enough, then the fucking pandemic hit and anybody that had a shred of social skills left lost it during that period of time. Like, I have this conversation and people will literally admit, my God, I'm one of those people. I know it. I have no social skills anymore. They're aware of it. Community is the only answer.

Britt East [00:35:52] What does it mean to. What does it mean to be in community?

Dwight [00:35:57] Well, community is. It can be. As few as as two people. As long as they genuinely care about each, others will be. You know, there's there's lots of frameworks around community. And I would say that we may have been tricked because there are groups that have been labeled as communities out of convenience. So, you know, we talk a lot about the LGBTQ plus community when really that that may just be a collection of people that might well, you know, the reason for the alphabet getting extended is because we're attaching labels to these people when they may be as as different as night and day, as you as you really approached them. They may not have any concern about the well-being of of any of the others in that group. I think it's dangerous to assume that just because people share a trade that they are the same or you can make assumptions about them. But when it comes to people that have a shared purpose, you know, things that they can really get behind and really care about each other, I mean, care is kind of the essential ingredient when it comes to community. That's really what it's all about.

Maddox [00:37:40] I think that the term community is misunderstood and certainly misused. I think it's very inappropriately used for the LGBT alphabet. I can't even say I'm all anymore. That's a group that's not a community. Yeah. You know, and I've lived in it for 44 years and and some of the. Well, most of the worst treatment that I've experienced has come from other gay men. In that said community to me, community is about a deep caring, true community is people who know you, people who like you, people who trust you, people who believe in you, build you up a place where you belong, a place that you know you can go. When there's no other place, safe place to go, A place where people have your back. And that's what we are building. And we're so adamant about it that we've got some pretty hard, fast, zero tolerance rules where when somebody can't abide by the kindness and the the uplift and, you know, when there's any division, divisiveness, I can't even say all the words. Intolerance, criticism, judgment. They're out. They're out. We will ask people to wait. There will be an exit door. Yeah. You know, we get that. People get in skirmishes time. We know that there can be some conflict. That's that's all good. But when you start making other people wrong or diminishing them, it's time for you to go. That's not a community.

Britt East [00:39:36] Who instilled or how or when was this instilled in you, this love of community, your ideas about community? Where did this come from?

Dwight [00:39:44] I'd say a lot of it came from my roots in that I, I was, I think, groomed at an early age to be in spaces where I had to be something other than what I was at, other than who I genuinely was. I've I've had some experiences where in interactions with with my own parents know, I know it comes from love. But I know for a fact that they. Would rather see me in a state where I'm pretending to be happy. Then to know if I feel anything that is other than just a perfect state. And it comes from a good place. But a. The things that I went through growing up prepared me for what it was to be enlisted in the era of Don't Ask, Don't Tell. You know, it was dangerous for me to fully inhabit who I was because it could have resulted in some pretty severe consequences, including, well, removal and possible possible time in prison. I think that creating a space where people can. Be who they are in a and share without fear of judgment. Fear of persecution. It's something that's needed now more than ever. I look at how we have so many ways that. People are driven by by fear. People are bullied. Were intimidated. And. It's. It's really hard for me not to. Not to think of the horrifying scenes that we had with with January 6th. And. I know that. That was just allowing things to. Manifest in the real world that we had seen only in online play. Up to that point. It was just a matter of time before we saw such escalations. And I feel that because we have other people in such a way that they don't seem real, that life isn't as precious and that things don't matter. It's set the stage for for those kinds of things. And it's important that we try to do something to get more in touch with humanity, more and more in touch with our own humanity, and create spaces where people, no matter how different, know how, even if they are just on opposite sides of any issue, that they can be seen and heard, that there is a space where they can share without without fear and know that. There's going to be a way where all ideas can I can see see the light, and no one has to worry. About well, about some horrifying scene. You know that. My goodness. You know, I think about how. History has shown us just how horrifying things can be. I'm glad that we're at a point where, for the most part, it's it's just. Historical. A historical reference to see burning crosses or to see the level of intimidation that we saw before the civil rights movement and reconstruction in the South. And I know that. It's our responsibility to. Make sure that we do what's necessary to keep us from regressing, from going back to those dark chapters. Because I know that there are. A lot of people that would like for us to be blissfully ignorant, to continue to stop thinking, stop questioning, and just continue scrolling. And. Go and blindly follow whatever violent path they deem necessary because they trick us into fearing something that isn't real.

Britt East [00:44:54] You know, a lot of people, it's so cool about you as a lot of people might have, you know, a different reaction to adversity and might withdraw or be suspicious of community. But you wanted more.

Dwight [00:45:10] Absolutely.

Britt East [00:45:11] That's beautiful, though. That's really beautiful.

Maddox [00:45:14] I'm the same way. I've always wanted more. You know, I grew up in a rural area in central Texas. And in 1977, I married an Hispanic woman. I you know, I just it's not that I hate when people say I don't see color. That's stupid. I see it. I just don't care. You know, I don't I don't choose people based on, you know, their level of education or their bank account or the color of their skin or. I choose people, whether it's friendship or our more than friendship based on who they are on the inside and how they show up in life. You you, you ask about, you know, what's the big draw towards community. For me, I think that the passion for community is. Born out of the lack thereof. You know, I was other. My whole life. Growing up all through my entire school years, I was. Bullied. I was treated poorly. I was a loner because just I was different. I was different. And I knew I was different. They knew I was different. I came out at age 24 and I thought, my God, my people, finally, everything's going to be okay. I could not have been more wrong. It actually got worse. It was not the same kind of bullying. But it got. It was worse. I got mistreated by the hands of other gay men more than I did with the straight boys. Growing up, you know, my brother called the other day and I was telling him about our our plans and our business. He said, So So this community, is this going to be for gay people or straight people or not? That there's a wrong answer, he said. And I said it's going to be for everybody. You know, we don't distinguish when it comes to sexual orientation. And I said, you know. Randall. We've got quite a circle of friends now after all of these. We've met some incredible people and we've got more people on our you can call and invite over list than we can manage. And I would say probably 98% of them are are straight people. Well, we certainly have gay friends, but, you know, we kind of fell through. But we had an event, a handful of people come over tomorrow night. We were going to be the only two at the table that were gay. The rest of them were going to be straight. And all of our straight friends treat us just exactly like they treat each other. Yeah. You know, they're just it's a no thing. And I don't even find that if if I'm in a room full of gay couples, I. I can't explain that. I wish I could. I just get along with people. I don't. I don't care. I've got friends from all. All walks. You know, and have had most of my life. But yeah, there's a lot of passion for community because I and we've adopted this, we agree on this that we believe for every problem, the solution can be found in community.

Britt East [00:48:59] So how can we encourage and ties, support, nurture people from the gay group, as you call it, to choose community?

Maddox [00:49:13] That's a tough one. And I'm not sure I have an answer for that. You know. I spent half of my lifetime just sitting in quiet contemplation over this, trying to understand why I think that after 80 episodes of my podcast, where I dug deep into every guest about their deepest wounds, the horrible things that they had to endure. I believe that we have wounds that run so deep. That we may never, ever overcome those wounds.

Dwight [00:50:01] Well, I'm a great believer in the world operating as a mirror showing. What it is that we have deep inside ourselves. We're going to see it everywhere that we go. And so I think that gay, straight or undetermined whenever you're. Going and you're you're seeing. Threats or, you know, you just perceive that there is something uncomfortable and everything that you're interacting with in the world. It's because part of you is bringing that. And I think if if you just reach to a point where you can. Just be kind to yourself. Be open and curious and just approach things with an open heart and open mind and just give people a chance. It doesn't matter. Even if people. Who you've known to have had a history of being angry or, you know, in some ways toxic.

Maddox [00:51:27] Part of that.

Dwight [00:51:29] You have to dig deep down inward and ask, well, you know, how could I be contributing to that? But not in such a way as to to beat yourself up about it, but to. Exercise some empathy. To appreciate that that person who might be screaming or might be the bully might just be a lion with a thorn in its paw. Show up with a little bit of curiosity and compassion. And granted, there are people who are are dangerous. You know, Biden by no means should you put yourself in a position where you're going to find yourself in a choke hold. But there are ways that you can let people know that that you are a safe person. Let people know that you can show up with curiosity. You can show up with kindness. And if they so choose to unlock it, then you've open the door and that's all you can do.

Britt East [00:52:37] I'm thinking about something I've shared from time to time on this podcast. I spend a lot of time in straight America. Maybe the majority of my time. Both personally and professionally. And one of the things that confounded me at first, or that's not quite right, maybe ten, 15 years ago, as I think back, was that I was pretty aggressive with my politics and polarizing and finding agency in kind of like queer rage and confronted with straight coworkers who genuinely loved me. And would, in the same breath, vote to eradicate me. The cognitive dissonance of the genuine affection, asking me about my husband inviting us over, and then immediately pivoting and saying no, no discrepancy and voting to, you know, remove my civil rights. They would ostensibly love to annihilate me in whatever way that they could. And who knows if and when and how they rationalize that in their mind. Like, I'm not that kind of gay or Brits this kind of gay. He's he's okay. He's not like the others. Or when I think of somebody as an individual versus as a group who knows how those mental gymnastics go. But it took me years to wrestle with that and to find a sort of peace and what it feels like. Spiritually to me is almost like unfocused in your eyes. You know, like when you look at those stereo grams and you and focus your eyes and the 3-D image pops out. That's what it has felt like to me to kind of like create space for grace. Room for redemption. And it's like, wow, I really don't understand everything. I really don't understand the depths of people's hearts and their souls. And yeah, I get pissed off about the way people vote and about politics and about this, that and the other, and that rage can be righteous and fuel action and all of that. But I think maybe, you know, what we have in common is like moving beyond the labels that define us and choosing to label us when it's fun or choosing the label or selves when it gives us leverage or when it feels good, it feels like home. But to not let it limit us in any way that we're so much more expansive, the breadth of us so far exceeds these meager labels. The words do not suffice. It cannot contain the complexity of the human heart, which never ran straight. So, you know, that's how I've wrestled with it. And I no way diminish the pain and the fear of what people are experiencing now or have experienced for generations. You know, it's easy to come up with a list of grievances that are very real of what straight people have done to this world. Straight men in particular have burned this world. And. But. I'm not going to waste my life dwelling in that caustic fire. I'm not going to sear. I'm not going to sear my heart in the fire. I'm not going to be, you know, bludgeoned on somebody else's crucible. And so that's that's how I have reached at least what today feels like, a detente, a peace where I still have this huge activist impulse, but I more than ever longed for the community. I mean, sitting here thinking, I can't wonder how I can move down where these guys are and go to their events because they sound so cool.

Maddox [00:56:25] Well, you'll need to come visit sometime. Amen to that. That would be awesome. We have had some people travel. Yes. Yeah, we had it. We had a woman come from. Where? Stephanie from Pennsylvania.

Dwight [00:56:38] Well, we've had Pennsylvania, Florida, and, you.

Maddox [00:56:42] Know, we've had some people, you know, kind of work their business, travel around so they could be in Dallas at the time of one of our events. It's been yeah, it's been pretty cool. And they're always like, my God, this was so worth making this trip.

Britt East [00:56:56] Or I do travel a lot, so maybe we can make that happen. I'm interested as we wrap up today to know what what gives you guys.

Dwight [00:57:04] Hope, You know, hope. I believe that I'll I'll go to the quote from Dr. Martin Luther King, where he was shortening the quote from Reverend Parker about how the arc of humanity is long, but it bends toward justice on a long enough timescale. We can see that things are always getting better. You know, we're going to be in some periods where we are in some depths. You know, right now we're in a phase where the whole world is leaning toward an authoritarian bent. And in the US, we've jumped on that train. But we'll be okay. You know, things. Things have been a lot worse. But the worst of us have it pretty great. If you just think about what it was like, you know, a century ago. I think that. The this past pandemic that we went through, it was just too long since the last one. And so we we don't have that that memory. Yeah. That that could save us know that that visceral, real feeling of it not being something that was in history books. So we kept making the mistakes, but thankfully we had a lot more tools to help us. You know, we had science that was that was quick to make it so that we did not annihilate ourselves.

Maddox [00:58:55] I think I'm going to sound a little bit like a broken record. It's okay. But what really gives me hope is being in that room and being in that room filled with that extremely diverse group of people and feeling the energy about how excited they are to meet each other and how excited the ones that have met before are so happy to see each other again with no regard to age or skin color or. Sexual orientation or any of that. It it's it is the one thing that because it's a lived experience, it's not some pie in the sky. It's a lived experience right there in this room. If we can do this for two hours right here, we can do this out there.

Dwight [00:59:50] And I'd say that feeling is as addictive as any drug, but far, far better for you.

Maddox [00:59:56] On the nights that we host events, I don't sleep. I'll sleep the rest of the night. I'm up all night long. Can't sleep. It pumps me so full of whatever drug your body produces Oxytocin, dopamine, serotonin. I can keep all of that straight. There is so much going raging through me that I don't. I never I plan. I know that I can't do have anything planned the next day because I'm going to be toast because I'm going to miss an entire night of sleep. Because I'm so revved up.

Britt East [01:00:30] My gosh. Well, gentlemen, it was so fabulous to talk with you today. Or you're always so inspiring. Maddox and Dwight, itwas just such a pleasure to meet you. I'm so thrilled about the community that you're creating. I think it's a model for all of us to be brave, to disrupt our behavioral patterns like Dwight alluded to at the very beginning of the show, where we maybe conditioned ourselves so gently into maybe some isolation that isn't serving us any longer. We're going to load up the show notes so everybody can find your socials, your website for the love of creatives.com. But soon enough to scribble anything down. We'll put all of that in the show notes. It was just so great to have you on. Thank you guys so much. I really, really appreciate it.

Maddox [01:01:15] It was really great to be here. It I amazing. You do an amazing job of interviewing and teasing the questions out. This was, you know, scale of 1 to 10. I got to give you a 12.

Britt East [01:01:29] Thank you so much. That means the world to me. I look up to you guys so much. So thank you for joining us. And dear listeners, you've made it through another hour of Not Going Quietly. We could not do this without you. Thank you so much for sticking with us for all your support, all your comments or your likes. Keep it coming. We are here to serve you. And by the way, this was our 50th episode, five zero, which is a lot for me because I have a full time job and I'm tired. So say this means a lot. But we got here together in our own community, which can be a model for us all. So thanks again to Maddox and Dwight for joining us. For the love of creatives.com. Bye bye now.

Britt East [01:02:11] You've been listening to not going quietly with your host Brit East. Thanks so much for joining us on this wild ride as we explore ways to help everyone leap into life with a greater sense of clarity, passion, purpose and joy. Check out our show notes for links, additional information, and episodes located on your favorite podcast platform.